We have thousands of human-written stories, discussions, interviews and reviews from today through the past 20+ years. Find them here:

Rethinking the concerto

February 14, 2008 at 11:46 AM

Since I've started playing again in the last year and a half, concertos haven't played a big role in my musical life. As an adult student with limited practice time, informal performing opportunities, and lacking access to an appropriate pianist, I just didn't see where they fit in. I did learn some parts of the Telemann viola concerto when I first picked up the viola. I enjoy the piece, listening to it can put a smile on my face, but honestly, as a technical learning experience, it's too easy. (Walton and Bartok, on the other hand, are HARD. Too challenging for me at my current level, at any rate). I've been happily puttering around instead with shorter pieces, etudes, and orchestral music.

But at my lesson this week we batted around this mad plan to audition for the LSO on both instruments again. I need two pieces in contrasting styles for each audition. For the viola, it looks like I'll be able to play the Clarke Passacaglia and a movement from one of the Bach cello suites, probably the Courante from #1. But for the violin? The Preludio from Partita in E would need too much work. A Handel sonata? Hmm, she says, maybe not challenging enough. Oh dear. "Could you play a movement from a *concerto*? Maybe Mozart?"

A concerto. Well, actually, in fact I did learn Mozart #3, 4, and 5 in high school. She suggests the first movement from #3. I sing a few bars for her--is that the one? Yes, you still have it in your ear, that's great. Wow. I really haven't thought about this piece in years and years, except for a discussion thread several months ago about whether it should start with a down or up-bow. (I voted down).

But she has a point. This is really a wonderful piece. So what if the last time I looked at it was during the Carter administration?

My teacher has told me that i should be able to sing all my violin pieces. I thought that this was my own little device that kept me going. As a beginner i can play all the Christmas Carols almost as if I didn't need any music at all because as an adult beginner I know how they are supposed to sound--I did not have to "learn" how an "A' was supposed to sound or a "G#" was supposed to sound--it was in there already so I have gotten over that mental "hump' and your blog entry really helped me! Thank you for sharing your wonderful story!
V.
Go for it. I will even email you my copy of #3 if you need it.
Thanks Tom, but I don't need it. I still have *all* my old music, including Mozart #3 (and "March of the Metro Gnome," which I played in 5th grade orchestra . . .)

My edition (Schirmer) has the down bow actually printed on the first chord, however. I had never even considered starting it with an up-bow until that thread.

What I could really use is a recommendation for a good recording or two. Any thoughts?

Ha! I did the #3 back in the 70s and now I’m doing it again with much better guidance and much more care. I just love it! I’m using the Barenriter urtex this time and noticed how many changes other versions have made to the original. As for recordings, depending on your taste, David Oistrakh and Syzeryn are wonderful. Try Andrew Manze if you want something ‘periodic’. However currently my favourite is Viktoria Mullova’s Mozart – crisp, interesting and original – what I believe Mozart meant to sound. You can't go wrong with any of the above-mentioned though. Have fun!
I downloaded Julia Fischer's last night from i-tunes. More listening material for the morning commute!
Grumiaux, Goldberg and Menuhin are my favorite recordings.
P.S., my version of #3 (edited by Rene Benedetti) starts with two straight down bows.
I tried it with the up-bow this morning. It makes less of a difference than I thought it would, after all that build-up in my mind.
I am not sure why anyone would want to start with an up bow. This is the first beat of the measure and where the violin comes in. Sounds like a natural for down bow to me.
BTW, who edited the Schirmer? Anyone you've ever heard of?
Ignore previous post. Franko edited it. I did not like his edits. Prefer Benedetti.
Check out the thread about down vs. up-bow. Anne, you responded the same way in both, with a simple "V"--could you elaborate a bit?
Since Anne's comment in the up/down thread is the same as here, I assume she says to start up bow.
I agree with Tom on Franko edition in general that is not so good, but his Cadensa is wonderful.
BTW, I am more than happy to email to anyone who provides an address, a pdf of my edition (which has no cadenzas) and the Franko cadenza.
V makes the opening light and springy, perhaps even chipper, whereas the down bow makes the opening more of a stern proclamation. No offense to those that start down bow, of course. I learned it down bow, but now I play and teach V.

As for editions, I really like the Franko cadenzas, especially in the 2nd movement. The Schirmer edition has the Franko cadenzas, but the editing in the rest of the part is a bit out of date. If you really want to go for a great edition, (and a fresh start, if you will) get the $$$ Barenreiter edition. It has a better piano reduction, an urtext violin part, an edited violin part (by Martin Wulfhorst) and a separate part with a selection of cadenzas by Franko, Ysays, Auer, and Wulfhorst. Very nifty.

I think it is a marvelous idea to get a fresh edition. What a nice way to re-work an old friend. Also, there is nothing finer than New Music Smell!

So . . . that's what I thought about Julia Fischer's recording: light and springy. Her cadenza is quite nice too, I think it's original.

But it was a little too light and springy for my taste. I couldn't keep the twittering birds and hopping bunnies out of my head. It's February, it's freezing cold, and there's still a foot of snow on the ground. I'm not in the mood for birds and bunnies (or winged cherubs, either--but people seem to like to put them on the covers of Mozart choral music).

Anyway, I kind of want to keep my old music, because it has my former teacher's markings in it, in his handwriting. Along with some annotations of my own (there's one place with an arrow pointing to a note that says "3 beats!" written in round 13-yo handwriting). He passed away 5 or 6 years ago, but I like thinking about him when I look back. He marked the part up quite a bit, so what I learned in the past is not exactly Franko either (he kept the double-down-bow opening, however).

Karen - although I understand Anne's great suggestion, I am with you on why you want to keep using your old edition. Mine has Benedetti's handwritten "edits of his edits" on it and reminds me of him and the wonderful experience I had taking lessons with him.
OK, I didn't mean to suggest that you toss the old music. Keep it, for sentiment, nostalgia, bunnies and flowers, etc., but buy a fresh copy, not only for a fresh start, but 'tis easier to alter previous editing marks.

Also, take up Holzman on his offer. He sent me a copy of his G major, and even though it starts (cough cough) down bow, it is still very interesting to hear, and you might get some swell new ideas.

Okay, yes, Tom, I would like to get a copy of your scanned Benedetti edition. I'll send you my email address. Thanks very much!

But (and I mean no offense to anyone's helpful suggestions, which I'm very grateful for), I realized this morning that quite frankly, I neither need nor want a "fresh start." This whole process--playing a stringed instrument again--is more about reconnecting with something important that was dormant than starting anew.

“This whole process--playing a stringed instrument again – is more about reconnecting with something important that was dormant than starting anew.”

Karen, this is why I like you so much: we share quite a bit in common yet we are so completely different!:) We have very different approaches to the past – not that one approach is better or worse than the other—just very different. Unlike you, I simply find reconnecting the past is meaningless, as I am a different person today than the Yixi 20 years ago, and I like today better and don’t want to be dragged back. I also happen to believe that our recollection of the past is simply a bundle of unreliable stories and mental images that have been edited and reedited in our head again and again over the years, so I tend to take a grain of salt towards those apparent causal explanations that link my past experience to the present situation, especially if the explanation depresses me or interferes with me moving forward. This is not to say that I ignore or block the past. In fact, I’m quite mindful as to how powerful our past can be and intentionally down play its role, as I refuse to give it more power than it deserves. When it comes to violin, I’m just too busy exploring new things and new realms to let the past affect me in any explicit way. I'm doing the Mozart g major entirely differently from what I remember I did in the past and I don't even want to think about its past, other than being reminded of a couple of bad habbits that I'm working hard to overcome...

But then, I’m the kind of person who periodically gives away personal belongings just to feel the download and renewal. I didn’t even keep my first publication, the drafts of my fictions, journals, the paintings and calligraphies that I did in the past. It might be the Buddhist influence or what have you.

You and I are very different, and I often wonder what I must have missed.

Incidentally, Karen, if you haven't seen Ben Chan's YouTube on the 1st movement of this piece, check it out:

http://youtube.com/watch?v=AvUsPxVHSiA

Thanks for sharing that point of view, Yixi. You're right, we have very different approaches to this topic, and I really appreciate your even-handed-ness about it. I think relationship to the past is a very individual thing.

In my case, I think it's something I'm "talented" in--in that I enjoy connecting to the past, thinking about it, and looking for insights there. I find the whole topic of memory to be fascinating, especially the neurobiology of memory (you might enjoy In Search of Memory by Eric Kandel). I don't think enough is known--or probably ever will be known--to be able to draw any absolutes about the value of memories to a given individual.

I had a boyfriend a long time ago, fiancee actually, who not only shared your view of the past, he was very adamant about it, that that's how it *should* be for everyone. The past doesn't matter, it drags you down, keeps you from moving forward, etc. etc. I was young, it was my most serious relationship to date, and I remember wanting to know more about his past than he was willing to tell me. I must have gotten uncomfortably close to something in my questions, and he got very defensive and lashed out. In retrospect I can understand better his reasons for wanting to keep certain things private, but I also think it was the right decision that we parted ways and didn't marry. We both needed to have our perspective on the past respected by the other, and he treated mine with contempt and anger.

I can't say my relationship with my teacher of the Mozart was perfect either; but it was pretty good while I was learning the Mozart #3. If I ever learn the Bruch G minor again, however (not that I have any current plans to at the moment), I'd need a completely fresh start there.

Thanks for explaining Karen. Although I have strong views about a lot of things, including my approach to memory, I guess I’m not quite as judgmental or dogmatic as your ex-boyfriend was. As you said, not enough is known of ever completely knowable. I tend to be attracted to the schools of thoughts aligned with Elizabeth Loftus and Daniel Dennett when it comes to issues of the mind, but I touched on that subject about 10 years ago. I’m always looking for different approaches and new insights. Kandel seems to be very interesting. Thanks for your recommendation.
Cheers.
Yixi

Violinist.com is made possible by...

Shar Music

Larsen Strings

Peter Infeld Strings

JR Judd Violins

Dimitri Musafia, Master Maker of Violin and Viola Cases

Pirastro Strings

Los Angeles Philharmonic

Elmar Oliveira International Violin Competition

Violinist.com Shopping Guide

Bobelock Cases

Violin Lab

Barenreiter

Bay Fine Strings Violin Shop

FiddlerShop

Fiddlerman.com

Johnson String Instrument/Carriage House Violins

Southwest Strings

Metzler Violin Shop

Los Angeles Violin Shop

Violin-strings.com

Nazareth Gevorkian Violins

Subscribe

Laurie's Books

Discover the best of Violinist.com in these collections of editor Laurie Niles' exclusive interviews.

Violinist.com Interviews Volume 1, with introduction by Hilary Hahn

Violinist.com Interviews Volume 2, with introduction by Rachel Barton Pine