The Shakes

March 6, 2008 at 07:10 AM · “...my whole instrument shakes, not just my left hand or arm. This leads to all sorts of other problems (back and neck tension, poor intonation, etc.)”

Karen, I believe the causal relation is probably the other way around: your tension is causing the shake. I used to do that and still do when I forgot to relax or when I get too emotional and the arm and shoulder tense up habitually. A Chinese teacher in his Kreutzer DVD that I recently brought back from China said this that I find helpful: when you do vibrato, imagine you are sitting in a sedan chair or a sofa and gently waving the fan to cool yourself -- that’s the mood to be in when vibrato. Hope this helps you as it does to me.

March 6, 2008 at 12:15 PM · Yixi, that makes sense, but I also think there's a feedback loop that goes both ways. The effort involved in trying to hold the instrument still does cause unneeded tension in other muscles, back & neck pain, etc.

I love the image of sitting in the chair fanning yourself--what fun!

But unfortunately for me, "trying" to relax in a general way is something of an oxymoron and never works. I just get frustrated and less relaxed.

Maybe I need to figure out and isolate which specific muscles trigger that unhelpful feedback loop. I still think it might be something to do with my left thumb based on the old injury. I've been watching a lot of left thumbs lately and been surprised again at how different they are from mine and why I never noticed that before.

March 6, 2008 at 12:54 PM · Good advice so far. I believe there is such a thing as too much vibrato. I like to think that vibrato is like a spice that can be added in different amounts to each dish (or phrase) as you like. I don't like to get carried away with arm vibrato because it tends to sound very robotic to me and much prefer working on finger and wrist vibrato which is much easier to control and more sensitive to your playing. Arm vibrato I think has a place only for long forte notes (imo). A little vibrato goes a long way.

Holding your violin against a wall? I hate to say it but this is a very poor and unthoughtful solution to this problem and I knew it wouldn't work even before I read the rest of your sentence. I would highly suggest getting a second opinion.

March 6, 2008 at 03:49 PM · Marina, Yes, a second (and third and fourth) opinion is what I'm trying to get.

I think we're in general philosophical agreement about the uses of vibrato. I don't have much arm vibrato at all at the moment. I was only taught wrist vibrato as a student (that I can remember) and I've only recently heard about arm vibrato on violinist.com.

What happens to me is that I will be on a low string and vibrating on a long note, and sometimes my instrument--and bow--will shake too. This is especially bothersome and difficult for me if I'm trying to play piano (the dynamic, not the instrument). Then the bow can come off the string and cause an uneven and/or thin sound.

March 6, 2008 at 04:19 PM · Holding the scroll against a wall is a very common teaching technique, and it does help certain students get a feel for what they are doing. Put a sponge or something between the wall and the scroll, though.

Usually, if it's shaking a lot, you are holding the violin (at least somewhat) with the side of your hand. Yes, if you are bending your thumb, you are undoubtedly doing a bit of clenching. Likely, you just aren't getting that "hanging" feeling that allows the tip of the finger to apply pressure to the string while keeping the rest of the hand, wrist and arm relaxed. If you don't like putting your scroll against the wall, you can have someone else hold it for you, but the idea is to having something supporting the violin so that you can hang from your fingers and get that feeling.

You can also try "hanging" your fingers on the side of a table and doing a side-to-side vibrato motion, just feeling pressure in the tip of the finger but relaxation everywhere else.

March 6, 2008 at 04:37 PM · Oh, I don't mind at all holding the scroll against the wall. I put a piece of paper between the instrument and the wall--and it's also kind of a soft wall. Nothing gets scratched or scraped.

I'm just finding, in between lessons, that I need more guidance about what I'm supposed to be doing and thinking while the scroll is against the wall.

Laurie, thanks for your comments about that "hanging feeling." You're right, I don't think I have such a feeling at all right now, but thinking about it that way while I'm doing the exercises (and mentally fanning myself :) might help me acquire it.

March 6, 2008 at 04:55 PM · I like Ben Chan's explanation a lot.

http://youtube.com/watch?v=wLTDCW5Rv8o

March 6, 2008 at 08:18 PM · Bilbo, I agree that was a very interesting video. I like Ben's manner and his way of speaking and explaining. He's very clear, approachable, and down to earth.

What I thought was interesting about that particular clip is that he actually seemed to accept a certain amount of shaking of the instrument was going to happen. He even demonstrated it, and the amount of shaking I get isn't really all that much more than he gets. Maybe a little more. (He also didn't play softly while his violin was shaking so he was able to keep his bow nicely anchored on the string--and usually I am able too when I'm using a bit more volume. So I don't know how he'd sound if he was vibrating, shaking, and playing softly.)

So now I'm wondering how serious my shaking problem actually is, since it doesn't really look all that different from his. And his vibrato sounds great . . .

However, he was careful to orient the instrument so that any vibrato-related shaking would be stabilized against the flesh of his shoulder and collarbone area, and I haven't thought about that before. I'm going to try that tonight, although my shoulder and collarbone areas are pretty bony.

March 6, 2008 at 10:45 PM · Greetings,

I may have been misremembering, but i think Misletins violin is shaking quite badly on his DVD of the Mendelssohn at soem points;

>But unfortunately for me, "trying" to relax in a general way is something of an oxymoron and never works. I just get frustrated and less relaxed.

That iscorrect. Tellign yourslef to relax is setting up a counter habit to the one of tension. It actually generates more tension. Try the verbal instruction `do less.`

I would also reocmmed you weork on your legs more. Try the exericse I reocmmed for the abducters, adducters in a blog about four months ago.

Cheers,

Buri

March 7, 2008 at 12:48 AM · If we are talking here about the hand "shake" of vibrato transfering too much to the instrument, I would suggest practicing some slow pizzicato with vibrato.

Just pluck each note and thry to relax your left hand enough to sustain a vibrato until the tone dies out. Next you might try getting the start of the vibrato as close as you can to the actual pluck of the string.

Work on this with all left fingers, starting with teh one you do best and ending up on the worst -- probably 4th finger.

This way you can study your vibrato without any right hand worries or sustained tone issues. Once you get this working, bowed vibrato tones should be a "piece of cake."