Schumann violin concerto
Has anyone heard of the Schumann violin concerto? there're 2... one's in D minor, and the other is in A minor (same thing as the schumann cello concerto--but schumann himself also arranged it for the violin).
Does anyone know how difficult either one is? Musically and technically... is it on a similar level as any other more well known concerto/sonata/piece? Just so that I can get an idea...
Replies (34)
Renaud Capuçon recorded the D minor.
It's a brilliant concerto, with some technical difficulties (bow and scales...).
The A minor is much more easier ! But to my mind, sounds best at the cello. Too "heavy" to be played at the violin, and not written first to be for the violin...
Best
AR
I have a recording of it... by Menhuin. I think it's a beautiful concerto, so why is it so unknown to most people? I would love to learn it and play it for my college orchestra auditions (its an ok college for music, the piece i play doesnt have to be like a tchaik violin concerto or anything), but i myself am not sure of its difficulty and I don't know how people watching me play would perceive it.
And yes, I do think that the A minor sounds much more beautiful on the cello. Do you think it's easier to play that piece on the violin than on the cello?
But I heard from some of my cellist friends who were working on the Schumann cello concerto that one of the difficulty of the piece is just getting everything in tune. Sort of like Mozart violin concertos (or at least how I feel about Mozart concertos), even after learning the piece for a while, it's hard to make sure each note is perfectly in tune and make the piece actually sound good as a whole. Is that true of most of Schumann's pieces (like this violin concerto), or is it just that specific piece (the cello concerto)?
I played this concerto couple years ago - it's not that difficult (last movement has several un violinistic passages) - it's a very nice concerto however probably not in the standard repertoire due to its suppression for all those years after Schumann's unfortunate demise, a pity...
Is a really beautifull work that in this time was palyed a little more. I recomended Szeryng recording with Boston Symphony and Antal Dorati
I also recommend young Menuhin's version with Barbirolli (1938), and add Georg Kulenkampff with
Schmidt-Isserstedt (1937)
I played this concerto a couple years ago. The passages are extremely pianistic, and not written in a great range for the violin. In my opinion, it seems a little...unfinished.
Josh Bell recorded the d minor Schumann...I don't know of any recordings (or frankly, anyone who plays) the a minor Schumann. A transcription of the Schumann a minor for violin? So when then is Sibelius concerto going to be transcribed for cello...
Kremer has a great recording with Muti of it. Also the early Menuhin recording is a classic, as well as Szeryng.
Storgårds has recorded a cd with both of them.
Great if you are having trouble with falling a sleep...
Look up Kremer's DG recording of the Schumann VC in Am with Boston Symp./Seiji Ozawa, coupled on the Cd with Shostakovich VC No2 !
I have a cd (number 57 on my blog januari 2006)of Schumann violinconcerto in D minor and violinconcerto in A minor opus 129 by John Storgards and the Tampere Philharmonic orchestra with Leif Segerstam as conductor, Ondine Ode 879-2
And I have heard A minor opus 129 (Schumann's own arrangement of his celloconcerto)in the concerthall (see my weblog from februari 2006) from Gidon Kremer. You gave me a good reason to listen again to this rarity.
Andrew Manze told me that when Menuhin was asked which recordings that best reflected his legacy - Lord Menuhin said it was the R Schumann and Bloch conertos (not even the Elgar VC with the composer made his own list).
Personally I have Szeryng, Muti/Kremer & Bell. Of these, I like Bell's the most.
There is actually a very nice recording of Frank-Peter Zimmermann as well. The problem of the d-minor concerto is that there doesn't really exist something like "Urtext" and in most editions the difficult parts have been made pretty simple. If you take the original it's one of the hardest violin concertos in my opinion.
Josh's recording is very nice, especially 2nd movement. The Kulenkampff recording is very interesting to listen to because he doesn't play the original either, but Hindemith tried to make the piece more "violinistical", and changed most of the solo part, and Kulenkampff then performed it. Zehetmair is to my knowledge the only one who really plays all the original notes, but it's unfortunately not a very good recording. I am not sure about the Kremer recording, but I think in the first movement he changed something. Anyway, it is one of my favourite concerti.
hm... thank you for all the opinions on different recordings. I'll look into trying a different one than what I have now. I'm just wondering, how difficult is this piece to learn? Is it comparable to any other better known concertos technically and/or musically?
julia, would you ever record this concerto?
Probably at some point. I still need to figure out a couple of places:-))) But yes, I'd love to.
Julia Fischer - If you ever get an invitation to play with the Malaysian PO, please insist that you play the R Schumann VC. Some years ago, Tetzlaff was suppose to play it but he changed it to Beethoven instead. So sad!
Promised:-)
Great, Julia. Thanks. I had a bash (sight read it with a pianist) once in London. Great fun, although it is now so "violinistic". Pity Tetzlaff changed the repertoire. Of course the Beethoven is the greater (and possibly the greatest) VC but it would have been good to hear the Schumann. Which is your favourite CD of the Schumann, Julia?
Well, I think it's Josh Bell or Frank Peter Zimmermann. Also the Kulenkampff is great. But I haven't heard all, so maybe I missed a good recording...?
Hi,
If you get a chance, try Kremer and Szeryng...good stuff:).
I want to hear it with all of Schumann's crafty notes. No Big Note version. That's the only way I'm drivin to Malaysia.
When Julia Fischer comes round the mountains to Malaysia to play the original version of the Schumann, Jim Miller is going on a round the world drive to Malaysia. Wow!
When she does it I'm drivin there to see it.
Is the original Schumann Concerto out for purchase? I'm interested in getting one, even if I can't quite play it :)
Cheng I recognize your disoppointment that tetzlaff did not play Schumann, but the well known violinconcerto of Beethoven. Last year Augustin Dumay wanted to play a violinconcerto of Chevalier de Siant- Georges, the black Mozart. But Augustin become ill, so someone else played... 5th Mozart
But it is great that Julia is interested in this piece and has ambition to record this rarity. And after her recording (and thus promotion) it will not be a rarity any more. It is great that she, a new growing name, joins the discussion, just like her manager FMF Fischer on violinist.com. More managers and prominent violinists should do that. But of course we are freaks and different from an average concerthallpublic.
I just have the new program for next year in the Concertgebouw in AMsterdam and Julia Fischer will play there the 3th Mozart violinconcerto in G KV216 (on 24,26,27 februari 2007, not yet on her website, perhaps FMF has to take action?), Mendelssohn in e (15 and 16 oktober 2006) and a piece of MAAZEL !!! for violin and orchestra on 14 oktober 2006. A violinfriend also wants to hear Julia in the Concerthall, so a good reason to go to that concert. But don't chage the programm Julia and don't become ill, because I don't want to miss this piece of Maazel.
Perhaps one day this piece of Maazel of Julia on cd together with the Schumannconcerto?
ten foot pole: go ahead, touch this one!
me: uh, no thank you.
Bram,
thanks for posting Julia F's schedule in Amsterdam!
Hope her father will take action again. How about a DVD instead of CD, Julia playing the Maazel concerto, then with him 2nd violin Bach Double d minor plus Schuhmann VC, the setting? Royal Concertgebouw!... wishful thinking in the heat of these days :)
Cool greetings, Hansjürgen
Hansjurgen, That would be a better dvd than the 4seasons DVD. Janine Jansen also had recorded this very often recorded piece of Vivaldi on cd.
aaaamm, second thoughts about second violin in Bach Double...if in case Lorin Maazel finds holding up the violin now is too heavy for him (2 years after his last NewYear's Solo) Julia might want to invite Lisa Batiashvilli to do the job, with LM wielding the baton - would be a great attraction.
I mean it. Hansjürgen
I think it's not played much because it is not effectively written for the violin. I have practiced it and heard it performed. Many passages in the finale are pianistic and wind up being hard to play and ineffective at the same time. Many passages in the first movement are in the middle of the range (A down to G strings) and are swamped by the thick Schumann orchestration. The slow movement is quite lovely.
Frankly, had Schumann lived longer in good health AND taken some advice from Joachim, the concerto would have turned out much better. It has some very good ideas that are vitiated by the ineffective writing.
I love this concerto the way it is. I'm not really sure why people think it's so strange.
Hello guys,
do you know where we can buy or find the partition of this concerto?!
Thank you!
The publication details. All prices in U.S. $
SCHUMANN, Robert Alexander (1810-1856)
Concerto for Violin in D minor, WoO 1 (Riedel).
solo: vl - 2.2.2.2 - 2.2.0.0 - timp - str
Pub: BREITKOPF & HAERTEL
PB05302 large score $87.50
OB05302 wind set, no strings 92.00
OB05302 string parts each 9.25
EB8648 violin & piano (Christian R. Riedel, Thomas Zehetmair) 37.00
---------------------------
Concerto for Violin in D Minor, WoO 1 (Tetzlaff) (Urtext).
Pub: SCHOTT
ED20871 violin & piano 19.95
------------------------
Concerto for Violin in D minor (Schunemann).
original publication.
Pub: SCHOTT
ED02588 violin & piano 26.95
ETP1822 miniature score 13.95
EU01822 large score & orchestra materials on rental from Schott. EAMDLLC in the U.S.
---------------------------------
All publisher prices subject to change. Contact your music dealer.
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July 8, 2006 at 12:43 AM · Joshua Bell recorded the A minor. It's on the same disc as his Brahms, which was recently re-released by Decca:
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0007WQHVM/sr=8-10/qid=1152319449/ref=pd_bbs_10/104-1478788-7133525?ie=UTF8
I'm sure other forum members can speak more about its difficulty, but my impression is that it's an underrated concerto, perhaps because it's not exactly violinistic. I think it's beautiful.