Anybody know how to practice your ears to perfect pitch (or relative).
Because sometimes i have problem with playing in tune. I need to concentrate so much to hear perfect tone. Thanks for answers.
If you had the "gift" of perfect pitch I think you'd know about it already, and it's not a thing you're likely to acquire with practice except in a rudimentary way. Relative pitch is another matter. I'm sure singing in a choir helped mine a lot
You don't want perfect pitch. Trust me. You don't.
There may just be a confusion of words here, I think Daniel is simply asking advice on how to learn to better recognize when something is out of tune. For me personally this is one of the few things I am just naturally good at. But, I think, listening a lot to good in-tune playing can help, as well as playing the passage in question on the *gasp* piano (yes I know this is not pythagorean or harmonically perfect, etc).
There are apps for ios which claim to help improve a person's pitch recognition. One's that I've experimented with would play a drone and then have a second drone join in and ask the user whether the second one was lower or higher than the first.
@Jean - discussions of pitch perception always fascinate me! I'm not sure playing or listening to the piano is likely to help train the ear in relative pitch. After all, it's theoretically possible to become a highly efficient pianist with no pitch perception at all. On string and wind instruments, once your technique is fairly well established it's also tempting to place the fingers unthinkingly. Quite a lot of players seem to do that! When singing, however, I don't think it would be possible to pitch a note even approximately without instant aural feedback and adjustment, so you're forced to think about tuning all the time.
I agree with Jean. Learning to play your violin with good intonation really has nothing to do with "perfect pitch." It has to do with recognizing how scales and intervals should sound and how they are fingered on the violin. The best thing the OP can do is find a teacher who can show him the basics -- how to find resonances ("ring tones") and how to establish a scale using wide whole steps and narrow half steps.
Thanks all for answers.
Since "perfect pitch" gets confused with "perfect intonation", I prefer to say "absolute pitch"( in French, the "absolute ear"..)
I've got perfect pitch and I couldn't even Said what was the note's name two years berfore
Real perfect pitch for a string player will be more a problem than an asset, and can't be learned or trained anyway. What is more important is learning good intonation, which involves interval recognition, tuning to open strings at the beginning stage, double stops later. I was in the orchestra once for a singer that had perfect pitch. She never needed a cue note in rehearsal. A very useful and impressive skill.
My daughter can sing any notes out of thin air. It's a cool party trick and it has its usefulness but for playing violin, it took many years to convince her that having a beautiful intonation isn't about playing every single note perfectly on pitch. I think she finally got the point after listening youtube videos of someone who has perfect pitch and has a rather awkward sense of intonation.
I have thought about this too. I'm a self taught beginner, with little musical talent.
Dale don't only look at tuner. First try to tune your tone by your ear then only check if you are playing in tune.
When you play D on the A string, you don't just hear it, you literally feel the violin resonating in sympathy (of course, if your D string isn't in tune, you are screwed!). Start there, then play A, B, C#, D over and over again until you are happy with what you are hearing. Do A,B,C,D too, so your second finger doesn't become too rigid. (include the E so your pinky gets some practice). Try Schradiek #1 major and minor on each string. Look for sympathetic Gs on the D and the E strings, and the pinky's notes will create sympathetic resonance on the string above. Then expand to wider ranges. Note where your fingers go, especially for the B - it's further from the nut than you think. My Bb and B were both flat until I realised my error. I never use a tuner. A piano is permissible, but not if you play it so much you spend too much time away from the violin.
To build a scale and sense of pitch (as in relatively in terms of interval), one should start with octave, fifth, then mediant, followed by supertonic, subdominant, the rest.
If a person wants to use a tuner that's easy to see, D'Addario makes the NS Micro Violin Tuner which attaches to the body just to the left of the neck, looking down on the violin from the top. That way it doesn't interfere with either the left hand or the bow. It can be used to tune the open strings of the violin and then switched off or it can be left on and the violinist can visibly check whether his/her impression of good intonation is accurate or not. It turns itself off automatically after 10 minutes. It can also serve as a visual metronome.
As far as I can see nobody has yet actually defined 'perfect pitch' to clarify the discussion. As I understand it, it is the ability to recognize the name of a note that is heard. A past (very accomplished) teacher once commented to me that the problem with players that have perfect pitch is that they 'always play out of tune', for the reasons alluded to above (your perfect pitch may not be the orchestra's tuning).
In an old thread, I had to defend the idea that Absolute Pitch is not limited to musicians (amateur or professional). Two examples:
There are two aspects to intonation: Being able to hear it and being able to land it (also known as target practice). When it comes to the nosebleed section of the fingerboard, I think the latter issue starts to dominate, because the demands on accuracy are severe and because the finite width of your fingertips becomes increasingly problematic. I don't have trouble hearing the notes, but landing them out of the blue is another thing. I suspect Elise's stand partner was just extra good at that, which may have nothing to do with his or her "perfect pitch" status.
@Elise. That's very interesting. It's clear that someone with perfect pitch should be able to play the correct note in the lower positions where the hand position can be referenced to landmarks on the body of the violin, but to immediately hit the right pitch at the very top of the fingerboard surely calls for superb finger placement skills also.
Anyhow, I'm just jealous. Bad grapes!
Paul wrote: "I suspect Elise's stand partner was just extra good at that, which may have nothing to do with his or her "perfect pitch" status."
It's like science: no-one loves us for being right!
I have perfect pitch and don't believe it is necessary to have in order to play in tune, however there are some major advantages that no one seems to be addressing.
@ James. Thanks for another fascinating perspective. However, speaking as one who has no perfect pitch but a pretty well developed relative pitch and musical memory I'm not convinced my disadvantage is as great as you imply. The ability to read a score accurately is surely a separate skill, possessed by many conductors who don't possess absolute pitch. I have known distinguished musicians in this category who definitely did seem able to "hear" entire scores.
I seem to be like Steve.
You raise a good point about conductors not needing perfect pitch to accurately read a score. I guess though that my opinions about perfect pitch relate more to the enjoyment and convenience of having it, rather than what it can achieve in the practical world, since I don't believe there is any profession which relies on having perfect pitch.
Fascinating James - so you propose that perfect pitcher's can read the music and hear it at the same time - sans instrument? Ever since I could read music I could do that, and I assumed this was typical for everyone who could read music?
As a beginner, I want something that would help me improve on hitting the proper notes. It would be nice to practice with a computer program that makes a game of it - trying to compete with myself and others at the same skill level. Something like Guitar Hero for violin? I'll check Activision's web site to see if this exists.
Absolute pitch does not help me hit high notes "out of the blue". But it does help me determine if the note is right or not.
Bo wrote: "Absolute pitch does not help me hit high notes "out of the blue". But it does help me determine if the note is right or not."
Not when it's Webern...
The other day we had to hit a high loud Eb out of the blue. I found what worked for me was to shift into 4th position in the passage before it: then it was much easier to find.
Dale Watkins asked if there was a computer program or something that could help with learning pitch. My teacher recommended a phone application to me called Perfect Ear which I have used with some success. It's not like Guitar Hero, sadly, but it does have a scoring element which makes it feel a little competitive.
--Gordon;-- That isolated Eb on the E string I usually find as D#, regular third position, with 4th finger slightly extended. An Eb another octave up is a different story, Maybe find the double E harmonic and pull back 1/4 inch. Hitting isolated ultra-high notes, with no opportunity for preparation, is my life-time nemesis, probably a major reason I never won a real pro symphony audition.
What James is talking about -- reading through fugues -- I suspect this requires mental abilities that go well beyond perfect pitch. I'd be curious if what he describes is a common experience among those who claim to have (read: can demonstrate that they have) perfect pitch.
I don't find that reading multi-layer music in one's head, with or without a "perfect" starting point, is very common, perhaps a quarter of the musicians I know.
All of them pianists I expect! In most music I imagine it's the note patterns and chord shapes that good pianists recognise rather than each individual note, but those with perfect pitch may have come to associate each line and space of the stave with a sound rather than just a letter. It's hard enough to understand the processes going on in one's own head, but how others hear music is a mystery wrapped in an enigma
Learning the piano did indeed work wonders for my sight-reading skill. It's just that piano teachers value it, so there was sight-reading at nearly every lesson.
A bit off topic, but do pianists when sight-reading have a conscious image of what they're about to hear, or do they just let their fingers take care of it? Of course the same applies to the violin, that one can bypass the listening process and let auto-pilot take over, but ideally I'm sure we should conjure up an impression of each note, interval or sequence of notes an instant before fingering
Joel, you're much better than me, but I find that "finding" high notes out of the blue is greatly helped by practicing single octave scales on a single string, in particular the E-string. For example getting to a high G with the first finger (required, say, because the phrase goes up from there). Find A in third position, then find C in fifth position, still on the first finger, and then "simply" finger arpeggio C - E - G fingered 1-3-1 which is a standard move in those scales on a single string. So, you basically mentally already play some structured notes in order to get to the note you need to find. I suppose this is a well known technique, I am sure it is mentioned by Simon Fischer.
Re ~ Perfect Pitch, Period! (44)
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