Jay Haide Guadagnini vs salvatore callegari european wood

Edited: August 13, 2019, 11:04 PM · hello guys, after months of trying out, i have two top contendors from private owners.

jay haide Guadagnini of asian wood 1400 usd
https://www.johnsonstring.com/catalog/shopmade-violins/haide-violins.php#item2

salvatore callegari of european wood. 1450 usd
http://www.sullivanviolins.com/Salvatore-Callegari-Violin-Stradivarius-Model_p_842.html

tonal quality: pretty even tone quality, jay haide a bit darker/warmer. callegari sounds a bit sharper in 2nd hand position.

playability. with the jay haide being a little better for double stop due to better setup

i would love to hear some input from you guys on which violin would you think i should go for. thanks in advance.

edit:
there is also a third violin i tested, its by a luthier named peter lam in NYC, its a strad model and i think by far the best i tried,
however i have some concerns
1. resale value, not mainstream as jay haide or callegari, so no idea if i can recoup my cost down the road if i choose to resale it.
2. its very light and open, almost a bit too open. maybe the top and bottom is too thin? will this effect the durability of the violin later on?

https://imgur.com/a/gH0fza7

my vibrato was the cleanest and most noticeable on this, and this violin has the biggest back arch i have seen on a violin i played. not sure what significance that holds.

https://imgur.com/a/lGehL9X

Replies (15)

August 13, 2019, 5:09 PM · The "private collector" doesn't make any sense. These are mass-manufactured Chinese workshop instruments. Nobody collects those; they have no long-term investment value or rarity.
August 13, 2019, 5:13 PM · Sounds to me like you're choosing your instrument based on which model it's based on and what kind of wood it's made of, rather than whether or not you actually prefer the sound and response.

Also, what kind of person collects Jay Haides?

August 13, 2019, 5:47 PM · I think when he says "private collector" he means individuals as opposed to shops.
August 13, 2019, 5:54 PM · The wood it’s made of doesn’t truly matter much in terms of its origin. Because wood is European doesn’t instantly make it a superior quality and the model doesn’t matter only the sound. They’re are dark instrument that are strad pattern and bright Guarneri patterned even though they should be the opposite.
August 13, 2019, 6:44 PM · Jay Haide violins from Ifshin and the Callegari violins are all decent Chinese-made workshop instruments. Just pick the one that sounds best and feels the best to play.

However, I wouldn't pay over $3000 for any of these. Similar workshop instruments that are in the holdings of my local luthier would only sell in the ~$2000 price range, if that.

August 13, 2019, 7:06 PM · sorry guys, yes by private i meant private owner, at least for the jay haide, the salvatore owner...i have no idea what his deal is but he claims he has 10 other violins including a european wood jay haide.

i know the wood doesn't mean much, i guess from a consumer point of view some may think its just better,

the jay haide had a slightly warmer tone in the 2nd hand position while the salvatore sounds sharper, i'm not sure if i'm describing it right. but the overall tone its about the same.

and no i'm not paying 2k-3k since i'm not buying from shop, i worked out with each owner for around 1400(no tax ofcourse)

Edited: August 14, 2019, 8:00 AM · I have found boxwood accessories just fine. I've got ebony, rosewood, boxwood and pernambuco Bois d'Harmonie tailpieces distributed among my 4 violins. They were all interchangeable among the fiddles except for the pernambuco that was worse than the others on all but one violin - so that's where it's been living for over 15 years. On cellos I have gravitated to boxwood accessories - on all 3 cellos.

At this price point I would not worry about the resale value - since that is probably what you are paying (actually probably close to what a dealer might pay you to for any one of these) and it will probably hold at that at least.

I would have no hesitation about buying the one that I most wanted to play.

August 13, 2019, 7:45 PM · thanks andrew! yes for the two more commercial mass produced jay haide and callegari for 1400 i'm not too worried on resale value, not that i buy and sell, and more like keeping it for at least a decade or so. but the less known peter lam violin for 1300, i think i would have to market the crap out of the violin or to someone who knows the luthier.

the peter lam also has a blemish on the varnish in the picture in 1st post, i dont know yet if such a blemish would trigger my ocd, but because of that blemish he knocked off couple hundreds dollar. despite that, i still think it sounds a bit better than the jay haide or calegori. not by much, perhaps a adjustment on the bridge or soundpost can even it out.

August 13, 2019, 9:01 PM · At this level, care about nothing other than playing qualities. Buy the violin you like playing best.
Edited: August 13, 2019, 9:07 PM · thanks lydia, so far the one that left the most impression on me is the peter lam violin, the only thing that bothers me is the one blemish on the varnish on the top, it looks like a small cigarrette burn. hence the steep discount he is throwing at me.

i think i might have to go and test all of them all again for a refresher, and play more complex pieces, with my own bow this time.

August 13, 2019, 11:52 PM · From a violin maker perspective, The Jay Haide instruments are better made than the Callegaris. Both come from the manufacturer with a marginal set-up, so playability and tone could be helped if they have not been to a decent shop. Also, I find that the Jay Haide instruments are much easier to sell.Whether that is marketing or quality I can not say.
Edited: August 14, 2019, 12:42 AM · thank you duane for your reply, i have spoken to a number of shops who carries both the jay haide and callegaris, from what i was told, jay haide spent significantly on their advertisement. you are the first that said the haide are better made. if you can go into more details on that i would greatly appreciate it.

i'm also friend with a local luthier who quoted me 50 bucks for bridge/soundpost setup. so that part i'm not too worried about.

Edited: August 14, 2019, 8:09 AM · "edit" When an instrument has a "bigger"("deeper") arch, top or bottom, there is less leeway in moving the soundpost "longitudinally."

From my own experience I would say that very small differences in the contour of the neck (cross section) and the style and/or location of the chinrest can have a big effects on vibrato motions.

August 14, 2019, 8:29 AM · Unless this is the last violin you will ever buy, resale value is important. Violins in this class will not appreciate over time; quite contrary. Market is already saturated with them and your chances to sell this fiddle will be slim unless you drastically reduce price and write off your loss.
August 14, 2019, 9:28 AM · hi rocky, yes i agree, thats why i'm only looking at private owners who quoted me 1400, at this price i can account my loss at the most minium, if i can only resale for 1000 i would only lose 400 vs buying it at 2400(jay haide) or 3200(callegari).


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