I know this is getting old but how are the eudoxa violin strings
I'm not sure that "they're not what they used to be." I'm not sure what that really means. If you buy them from a large supplier like Shar they'll probably be fresh.
I grew up on Eudoxa, but never liked Olives. I hated the A string. It may depend on the violin itself.
The last time I went through a gut fetish, I do remember that the gut I liked the best (or rather, hated the least), was the Kaplan Golden Spiral. They're less expensive than Pirastro, and seemed to actually play better.
I talked to a D'Addario representative a couple months ago at the NYC Mondomusica, and it seems that they are unfortunately phasing out the Golden Spiral gut strings (but keeping the steel E strings) - I liked the A string a lot, myself.
I am not sure that gut string can go bad in a few months if stored properly. Most of violin shops here in Toronto pay a lot of attention to humidity level; there are too many instruments hanging around that they can't take any chances.
In addition to that, Eudoxa is still the top seller at lest in one of them so I doubt that they stay long before being sold.
A nice alternative to Eudoxa are Lenzner Supersolo. They come with pure gut A.
It seems then that Pirastro are the only remaining suppliers of wound gut A-strings, with the Eudoxa as probably the best choice. Fortunately it is a good string, as are the other two - well worth trying out if only to see what we've gained and lost with synthetics.
Eudoxas seem to have been around for ever, but when were they first introduced and what did they replace?
Here's a good video with that Eudoxa sound:
I believe Eudoxa is an excellent wound gut string. I use it for the G sometimes (or a Tricolore G) usually with a Tricolore plain gut D&A and steel E. Lots of people are using the Passiones by Pirastro (which is also wound gut) but in my opinion the Eudoxas or Tricolores are just as good if not better, and they are much cheaper than Passiones.
I played the eudoxas a lot in my youth. I loved them, but as I learned to know the olivs I started to prefer them a lot. I just once tried the oliv A string and it was a very open sound, but the tuning was terrible.
Eudoxa are very much on the mellow side compared to olivs and synthetics, therefore they are "classic" wound gut strings. It depends on your instrument if that works for you.
The stiff version is not compareable to the oliv stiffs. Eudoxa stiff is still very mellow and feels like they have still very low tension. Oliv stiffs have a lot of the good variables of synthetic strings, wich is a certain edge to the sound and quite ok tuning stability. I would totally prefer them to Eudoxas. But that also depends on what kind of music you want to do play and how your instrument reacts to the strings.
I would generally assume, that on a modern instrument wich is build with synthetic strings in mind, eudoxas will just not work properly. (but they always work to a certain extend...) On an old instrument, Eudoxas will let the instrument breath and the sound could possibly change to more intense. Its really a question of the instrument and setup, because those strings are special.
I personally don't like how they respond to the bow. They need a certain reatment wich for me is to different to mine and also not my ideal of sound.
I would recommend Oliv stiffs (or regular) on G and D, and a good matching a synthetic or steel core A string. Just for having a reliable A. The PI are to my feeling quite similar to the gut strings, maybe somewhere between eudoxa and olivs.
I have got "a modern instrument wich is build with synthetic strings in mind" that sounds at its best with Eudoxa strings.
Ironically, the maker delivered it with Vision Titanium. I could stand them less than a day.
SInce then, it has been growing up with all kind of gut strings, from Olive, Passione, Lenzner and Eudoxa.
yes, I already thought, that my generalisation will be proven wrong. Sometimes the builders of the instruments don't know the best strings for it. I am pretty sure that expecially with gut strings it comes to small details, wich gives us so many variables, like weather, humidity, setup of the soundpost and bridge, that any generalisation is difficult. ts actually my dream to make gut strings work on my fairly modern instrument. But it usually goes well with the heavier strings and I am afraid to change the setup, because it works. But gut on a good modern instrument can in my opinion be a very good symbiosis. Especially on those which lack warmth and depth.
yes I agree to the tension, but what about eudoxas? They certainly feel very low tension to bow and left hand?
I am playing on Eudoxas - D & G brilliant medium gauge and a 13 1/4 A. Although they might not be as readily available around every corner like Dominants perhaps, they are far from hard to get fresh. I have tried quite a number of strings (gut, synthetic and some metal ones even) and I play regularly on plain gut strings including the e. Somehow, I always come back to Eudoxa because of their sound which I find unpretentious by default - and I mean it in a best possible way. It is possible to play pianissimo one can barely hear and yet that carries a long way if the room allows it, and yet they get quite loud as well. For the "gut sound", since it is clearly quite a personal matter of taste, I would rather suggest to try plain gut strings, find the qualities one likes most and then try the wound strings. What bothers me with Olives for example is that they do sound pretentious to me from the start, often leaving me wishing I had the choice of playing less then they can offer. Especially considering the price! I'm not having that problem with both plain gut or Eudoxa. As for the bow & finger response, I've tried thickest stiff version and I'm currently playing on thinnest A available - to me it is not much of a difference but it is more noticeable compared to synthetic & metal alternatives. As for the instruments, IMHO they are the only strings that do work with all instruments and are my strings of choice when trying instruments. I find them the most honest option. They allow me to hear the instrument, and not the strings. Of course one can later try to bring out different qualities with different strings, but I've had experiences when seasoned "dealers" tried to mask instrument's faults with soundpost - string mix combination!
that was a great comment. You are right about the neutrality of Eudoxa strings. They provide the same on viola too.
I agree what you said about Olive brand. Passione even go further than that, so I felt at loss when I put them after Eudoxas.
Its quite a matter of taste and demand. I think the Eudoxas are great strings, but I am pretty sure, they don't work on every violin.
But what is much more important: Eudoxas must match your playing style and one has to adept to it. Compared to Synthetic strings they need a very different treatment.
Maybe it would be beneficial if everyone connects his/her opinion with a short information about the personal field of application.
1. As i wrote here around 20 times in different threats already i have a problem with tuning all the time, since it disturbs, if you play in ensembles. Its not professional anymore to retune every 10 minutes.
2. I like playing bach solo on gut a lot! But in other repertoire, like tango or (post)romantic violin literature gut strings bring problems, wich are not there with (most) synthetic strings. For example synthetics stand much more bow pressure.
Also important in combination with gut strings is your bow. Some bows are too heavy for gut... or lets say they are not balanced the right way for the needs of gut strings.
If we don't take into consideration those and maybe other variables, the discussion lacks a certain realism.
Of course Eudoxas can work on every violin, but not even every violin works for me... its all very personal and I come to the conclusion, that everybody has to try on his or her own.
All I can say is that gut strings sound much nicer after they are made. ;)
I personally love Eudoxas but I do not hide that they are really capricious compare to synthetics and that I have never tried other gut strings. But the sound is very good and that is what makes me stick with them! I am of those who prefer sound over perfect playability and stability. I'm an amateur, I do not need perfect strings :)
To be honest, Anne-Marie, they are rather perfect. :) I do not use the A, though, always using a steel alternative. But as an "amateur", you are really using a high-quality, professional string in the Eudoxas.
Was using Passione Solo, which I tried due to the kindness of Pirastro in sending me a free trial set. Great sound! I liked them more than regular Passione, their projection was quite nice, though they did lack some depth vs the other alternatives. I, however, do not consider them to be "like synthetics", just less of the traditional "wound gut sound", but still gut (the response is easier than with Eudoxa, but you still have to be careful with your playing, as they are not as forgiving as synthetics-it is ironic, though, that high tension synthetics can also be LESS responsive than a high tension wound gut string, though.) Beautiful sounding, the Passione Solo are a great sounding, well balanced set (though I didn't love the E, quite honestly, as nice as it sounded, perhaps because I am used to "more substantial" Es), that offer a powerful, clear, and stable gut sound.
I bought yet another pair of Stiff G/D Eudoxas, and gotta admit that I immensely prefer their tone over any other G or D string I've ever used. It's not just about liking a warm/dark sound-they just sound great, and never muddy on my violin. Once they stabilize, the intonation problems are minimal, and you automatically adjust it with your fingers and without thinking (quite honestly, if Mr. Oistrakh and Mr. Milstein could play in tune with Eudoxas, we certainly can as well.) The D is prone to go out slightly out of tune downwards by merely touching it for any length of time, but it soon re-stabilizes-it's just a quirk, "the nature of the beast", and not a true problem/defect (and also because I use the highest gauges for both strings-I imagine if they were the lowest tension, that problem might disappear, but I do love the tone of the highest gauges, so I stuck with those.) Also, as you play more and more over the day, the "detuning" effect is minimal. So for all their supposed weaknesses vs modern strings (and I do respect modern technologies and am always hunting for good sounding strings of any type), the Eudoxas are indeed a superlative string-not outdated, wimpy, "too mellow", or "too dark", at least not IME with my violin.
The advantages of Eudoxa vs Passione for me is that despite the "issues" with tuning, which is not a big deal once they get fully stable, they are way more affordable and still offer a great tone-IMO, better than the Passiones, but I admit that is my subjective opinion. Simply put, when the Passiones were new, I thought they sounded great, but did lack a certain depth the Eudoxas had... the Eudoxa tone was better than the Passione sound to me, when new, and even months later.
The high tension Stiff Eudoxas are supposed to have among the more sluggish response of all strings, but I don't find it to be a problem. They play better than, say, high tension Obligatos on my violin. I am glad to say that I am used to play them, so the usual problems while playing wound gut strings for me (besides the tuning issues if the humidity suddenly changes) are not really issues. Being "Stiff" and high tension, the tone is really hard to crush-you really have to try hard to do that, and realistically in my case, I really don't need to play that way. You can play fast too no problem-the response becomes an issue perhaps for players not used to them, but they are still violin strings!-you can learn how to play them with both clarity and a powerful tone (the "Eudoxa are not powerful enough" must be a myth?!)
That said, there must be a violin in which Eudoxas don't work well with, or perhaps the player is not ready yet to try them on (this is an honest possibility, and not a slight on any player's capabilities.) Or simply, a player may not like them at all, which IS valid, no matter how great the strings may be. There are genuine concerns and "cons" to these beautiful, rich sounding strings, but IMO, they are not strong enough to dissuade me from keeping using them-even if they have been replaced by the vast majority of orchestral and chamber players, as well as soloists worldwide by other modern, great sounding alternatives. I would strongly suggest to try them sometime, and do not just play them because your favorite artist used to play them, but only if they work for you-on the same token, just don't dismiss them for their common cons without giving them a chance, just because most players don't use them anymore nowadays, as what they do offer, is hard to replicate elsewhere.
(Out of subject, anyone knows of other great sounding steel As? I've used Prim medium, "orchestra", and the Larsen Steel A, which is pretty great (my current string). I am always curious to try new steel As, but my caveat is that I must be able to remove the ball and use them as an E-loop string would be used.)
(Too bad they are deleting the Kaplan Golden Spiral gut strings. That makes the Eudoxa the best wound gut deal around after Gold Label strings, which come only in one tension.)
Golden Spiral were REALLY good before they merged with Red-O-Ray.
The Spirocore steel A is quite good. The Flexocore Permanent A is very fine and sounds well with Eudoxas; it's a little more refined sounding.
I'm a long-time Eudoxa user - I also occasionally like to use the Kaplan Golden Spiral A (silver-wound gut), but I don't think they are available AT ALL...!
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