How to glue the violin end pin.

March 6, 2012 at 04:50 PM · What sort of glue should be used to fix the end pin of a violin ? What sort of glue COULD be used instead if the first choice of glue is not readily available ?

I have noticed that since the return of the warmer weather, the end pin is coming out of my violin. As there are no luthiers where I live I will have to fix it myself.

Replies (22)

March 6, 2012 at 05:10 PM · I'm pretty sure the end pin is NOT to be glued in. Maybe you can order one with a larger diameter? The hole is probably worn, which would require a luthier.

March 6, 2012 at 05:30 PM · I'm sure someone who sets up violins for a living will respond, but until they do, hold off on the glue! (nice rhyme)

Your end pin isn't a good fit, and glue isn't the correct way to make it right.

March 6, 2012 at 05:44 PM · Brian, the end pin is NOT glued. It is fit in a block of spruce behind the hole on the inside that provides strength for the forces of the strings that are pulling on the tailpiece and ultimately on the end pin. Do not glue it.

The hole is generally tapered 1:20 along with the end pin. If you take it to a luthier, he/she can replace your end pin with one that is just a little larger. They can clean up the hole with a reamer and fabricate a new end pin to fit "your" violin.

Please do not glue the end pin.

EDIT: Brian I didn't pay attention to where you said that you have no luthier in your area. I have the violin tools to fix this but I also used these tools on a violin of little to no value. You would need a reamer, a peg shaper, and a new end pin. You can get a new end pin from Dov Music. They have good prices on fittings. The reamer and peg shaper are expensive and rightfully so. I almost think that the prices for these tools are high to keep people from doing their own violin work. You can mess up your violin quickly if you don't know what you are doing.

The hole for your endpin is probably out of taper due to forces that mis-shape the hole. Over time too if the hole wasn't a perfect taper, it will get worse. You will need to ream the hole ever so slightly and the use the peg shaper to fit the new end pin. This isn't easy. My end pin hole was not perfect either and I actually glued new spruce into the oversized hole, re-drilled, and re-tapered the hole. I also destroyed several end pins until I got the final one to be perfect.

I am an engineer/computer scientist and my father taught me how to use almost any tool imaginable. But, I was still fearful that I would destroy my violin in the process of using these tools to fix my end pin.

I would say that if you believe that you can fix this yourself, please be aware that you can also cause harm to your violin.

A short term fix for this might be a piece of paper to bushing the end pin or increase it's overall diameter. You could do this until you find a luthier. You can ship your violin to the luthier and he can ship it back repaired.

March 6, 2012 at 09:29 PM · Woops, I should have done a Google search BEFORE I asked this question. As mentioned above, glue is not used.

David : I thought the taper was 1:30 which is the same as the peg holes ? I have a peg hole reamer and a peg shaver of this taper. I will pull out the endpin when I get a chance this weekend and have a look. Using some paper to create a tighter fit sounds like a good idea until I can buy some endpins.

It is a brand new violin from China so nothing should be coming apart but these things happen. I have spent the last few days taking about 3mm off the top of the bridge as they had it cut very high. I intend to fit a Wittner tailpiece and some new strings when and if they ever arrive from the US. (I have been waiting 30 days now !)

March 7, 2012 at 02:53 AM · One of my local luthier used a small piece of scotch tape as temporary solution by sticking on the end pin so the end pin can fit into the hole better. It can be removed anytime.

March 7, 2012 at 09:00 AM · "It is a brand new violin from China so nothing should be coming apart but these things happen."

So sorry about your purchase.

March 7, 2012 at 09:01 AM · I will order a few end pins from Brisbane in the hope of finding one that is a closer fit. In the mean time I will just use some paper to make the present end pin a tighter fit.

March 7, 2012 at 12:42 PM · Emily : I bought this violin with the intention of doing work on it so I am not disappointed. If it sounds half decent with good strings then I will fit it with Wittner geared pegs. I have already lowered the action because the bridge was much too high. That has improved the sound already which quite surprised me.

The violin only cost $270 including postage. I was not expecting too much but I think with a bit of work it should turn out okay....perhaps even more than okay.

I still have my cheap Valencia violin for daily practise which I purchased here. Even that needed new strings and a new tailpiece when I got it home.

March 7, 2012 at 04:58 PM · Brian, I'm curious now where your violin came from exactly. I have 4 violins now after a quest since December 2011 to find an "inexpensive" to start playing on again. I won't describe the first 3 but I love the violin I have now. It came from Yitamusic and the "T" shop. It was made and signed by Lui Xi. It's their T19+ model. I received it in the mail and the only thing I did was change the strings to Dominants. It's perfect for me because it sounds wonderful, plays wonderfully, and it's pretty overall. I used to play a German Strad copy that I sold for $3800 US to a professional in the Virginia Symphony. This violin "sounds" better than that one did. I paid $152.50 for this violin. I haven't said anything on here about this violin because I didn't want to jinx my find. The other violins I have acquired prior to this are okay but I wasn't satisfied.

My first was a Franz Hoffman Maestro from Shar. It's okay but I purchased a beginner instrument because of budget alone. The next one was a Jacob Stainer copy labeled and marked 17"94". I refurbished this one because I was really looking for a "player" and not an investment. The last one before the Yitamusic violin was a Hofner, Alfred Stingl AS-360 (retail about $750 US). This violin was loud and very treble sounding. I think the varnish is really not varnish but factory spray lacquer. Anyhow, now I have 3 violins and I've had no luck selling them. But, ... I now have my player.

I was really surprised at the quality of work on this violin and the fretboard was shaved perfectly. It really plays well. And, I can tell because I've played other violins and I've even played a couple of very expensive instruments.

I'm curious about your "Chinese" violin because I have read that most require a lot of set up after they are received. My research of Yitamusic has shown that their quality has been on the increase. I still don't understand how they can sell their violins at such a price but I'm not complaining because I found my "player". I just spent more than I wanted looking for that violin that cost less than $1000 US. I just "knew" that I could get a violin for less than a thousand dollars that I would enjoy playing.

Let us know more about your violin.

March 7, 2012 at 05:10 PM · You're not supposed to use glue. It is also called an 'end button.' An end pin is what goes on a cello.

March 7, 2012 at 05:47 PM · David : this Chinese made violin was purchased from a seller in China through ebay. They have a number of violins made by about 7 different workshops. There seem to be two main Chinese sellers on ebay doing this.

I tend to agree with your experience that you end up with about 4 violins before you find one that you really like. Price does not have too much to do with it ; you do not always get what you pay for. I have owned $1,000 violins that were complete rubbish and a $200 violin that was absolute magic. You pay your money and take your chances when buying online and that is all you can do with no proper violin shops and luthiers close by.

I really do not want to bag this ebay seller because some of his other violins may be fantastic. Mine just needs a bit of work before I can give a true opinion of it.

March 8, 2012 at 05:08 PM · John : Maps can be deceiving. Most people take three days to drive from Cairns to Brisbane. The Bruce Highway which is the main road down the coast is one of the worst roads in Australia. Parts of it resemble a pot-holed goat track in some third world country ! It has been ten years since I drove the full distance but truck drivers tell me that it has not improved much.

The upside is that not having easy access to a luthier forces you to contemplate doing things yourself and learning new skills. Yes, I know.....any luthiers reading this will be shaking their heads or laughing ! Now, where is that sound post setter ?

March 8, 2012 at 09:38 PM · When he was putting a new set of fittings on my violin, the new end-button turned out to be just marginally thinner than the old one; he ended up just wrapping a piece of sandpaper around the button. It's held up great for the several months that I've had this instrument, although I do hope he decides to fix it properly one day...

March 9, 2012 at 12:19 AM · Brian Kelley, I love wonderfully fitting parts, but an endbutton needs to be frightfully fitted almost beyond belief to move on it's own while under string tension, unless a lubricant has been applied.

Check whether it is staying in place at incremental stages while bringing the strings up to pitch (stiffness of most tail adjusters will tend to pull the endbutton out), and push it back in as needed.

If that works, it ain't exactly the pinnacle of our business, but I'm a confessed fiddle snob, trying to balance that with situational needs, such as yours.

March 9, 2012 at 04:53 AM · David : I have replaced the tail piece with a Wittner (built in fine tuners). This gave me a chance to have a good look at the end button. It is not coming loose ; it has never been fitted properley and it only looks like it is coming out. It should have been pushed in another 2mm. I have tried to move it but it will not go in or come out so I think I will leave it alone for now unless it starts causing problems.

I am not really sure how to get it out as it will not submit to pulling it out with the fingers and I am reluctant to force it. I suspect that they may have used a small amount of glue when they found it did not fit properley.

March 9, 2012 at 06:03 AM · Maybe if you can cool it down, the end-button will get looser. Or fly south to Adelaide for a few days.

Andy

March 9, 2012 at 03:00 PM · I'm not sure that the sound post fit gets more tight in drier weather. My understanding is that it gets looser, but maybe I'm wrong.

March 9, 2012 at 04:52 PM · I have found that when the weather turns warm quite suddenly then the violin pegs will all 'pop' and come loose. So if anything is going to cause this end button to drop out it will happen when all this rain stops and the sun comes out for a few days. But I could not budge it using my fingers so I will not be holding my breath waiting for something to happen.

March 10, 2012 at 04:26 AM · John : our wet season in the tropics is in summer which is just finishing. I can asssure you that it has been VERY wet this summer over most of Australia !

March 10, 2012 at 08:27 AM · Yes I agree, we had the very wet summer in Wodonga this year too, so much so that the humidity caused me to use Baker's citron rosin instead of the original kind, I'm glad I got both, I wasn't going to at first. Otherwise, and luckily, my violin behaves whatever the weather. I did the infamous 'goat track' all the way to Cairns from Brissie last year, and the description is very apt. Not only is it winding and slow in places, they must've decided to start road works in about 10 different places all the way up. Very frustrating to say the least. It took us 3 days.

I had a violin for years where the end button was very loose and I just kept shoving it back in and didn't think much of it. I suppose there could have been a sudden release one day, but it never occurred.

So thanks for the heads up re the lack of luthiers in Cairns, Brian. We are thinking of moving up there soon and I think I should get my baby all checked over before we do. How well is the place represented by teachers?

March 10, 2012 at 09:26 AM · Millie : there are 5 violin teachers listed so that is not too bad. Do a google search and there is a Music Teachers Association of Queensland website which lists teachers in a particular area. I know when I lived in Brisbane it was almost impossible to get a violin teacher : 'Sorry, I only teach children.' or 'Sorry, I am all booked up and I cannot take any more students'. It was very frustrating.

So 5 teachers isn't bad considering the total population of this area is about 140,000

March 10, 2012 at 11:30 AM · Great news, thanks Brian, I was a little worried about teachers. And it looks like I'll have to come to you for repairs, if I ever need them ;)

Good luck with your end button.

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