December 14, 2007 at 05:36 AM · and what do you think about the Sound thay use?
December 13, 2007 at 08:47 PM · For me of corse - Sandor Jaroka!!!
December 13, 2007 at 08:51 PM · i tell you a few Violinist, and you can watch tham, and than you tell me who you like more??
you type in Youtube.com
sandor jaroka , roby lakatos , erno kallai , lajos boross , bela berki , bobe gaspar erno , kalman banyak , santa ferenc ,
geza hosszu legocky , ...
you can find many more, but this are the basic gypsy violinist, who are really greate, and i think it is really interesting to watch and talk about becose it has a same Violin tradition as Classical Violin.
and there is also a lot to talk about i think!!
Thanks for answering
December 14, 2007 at 05:46 AM · I like Ernő...I didn't listen to all of them yet but he has an especially appealing tone. Sometimes I find these gypsy violinists to have too "sugary" a sound for my taste, but not him.
My first loyalty is still to Sándor Lakatos though...I have some of his CDs and they're great.
(and Géza, I just have to ask...magyarul beszelsz?)
December 14, 2007 at 07:46 AM · Currently, and unfortunately it's not gypsy, but it's Professor V., who I'm learning some things from.
December 14, 2007 at 01:17 PM · Of course it is you Geza!
How are you??? Your english seems better :)
December 14, 2007 at 01:43 PM · One of my favorites is Martin Lass! I love his "Gypsy Violin and More" video! There is nothing like Hungarian/Gypsy violin music, especially the slower stuff. The slow stuff is so gorgeous! Very expressive and extremely schmaltzy!
December 15, 2007 at 01:05 AM · I only wish there were videos of Dinicu!
December 15, 2007 at 01:57 AM · I'm not qualified to say, but I'd like to hear more about eastern European classical violin traditions, as a reflection of the gypsy foundation.
I know some about Bartok, as for some strange reason I've studied about him lightly over the years. But, what were the schools of thought, the conservatories, and that type of thing...
Janine doing "Romanian Dances" was my first immersion, so over time....
December 15, 2007 at 02:11 AM · Albert, as far as I know the Hungarian classical tradition developed quite separate from the gypsy tradition. The classical-Romantic tradition grew mainly out of German influence. It began with Joachim, who was as much German as he was Hungarian, and the man who is generally acknowledged as the fountainhead of the great Hungarian school of violin playing, Jenő Hubay, was also originally German-trained.
Repertoire-wise, there's apparently more of a link to the gypsy tradition in all those csárdás-style showpieces and things like "Impressions de la Puszta", but even those come by way of the Brahmsian-Lisztian "gypsy" aesthetic; the music played by the gypsy bands in Budapest also was just as much influenced by Austrian popular composers as any Hungarian and/or Gypsy folk tradition. (The amusingly ironic end result is in the late-nineteenth century, when Hungarian cultural nationalism reaches its anti-Habsburg zenith, you've got composers defiantly writing patriotic tone poems full of "Hungarian Gypsy" music which is really more Austrian in origin than anything.) (Not to say, as the young Bartók often did, that such music is "un-Hungarian"--it's not--it's just kind of ironic.)
Around the turn of the century, Bartók was establishing himself as a composer but getting progressively more annoyed with the musical establishment. There’s a quote from him somewhere about feeling obligated as a Hungarian patriot to make use of popular „national melodies“ but repulsed as a composer by their frequent banality and artifice. A chance overhearing of a Transylvanian peasant woman in singing an old folk song led to his folk-music-collecting excursions with Kodály and their subsequent redefinition of Hungarian music.
Back to violin: in Bartók’s writing for the violin, a clear link to the peasant tradition (not the gypsy tradition) CAN be seen. Especially in the two Rhapsodies, his use of the instrument is very clearly influenced by the techniques of the peasant idiom…and more details on THAT once I figure out how to play those darn pieces (working on No. 1 right now.)
OK, everybody can wake up now, lecture’s over.
December 15, 2007 at 09:12 AM · Thank you Mara! Separating the influences for me, is new... I knew about Bartok's excursions, but the more subtle flowing of just several things(Austrian pop, nationalism), and so on, I intend to internalize in my understanding.
Also, I had forgotten about reading an interview and remarks about Hubay some time ago some of those facts... Time to review I think.
I also didn't make a good distinction in my mind I think, between Gypsy and folk--something I hope to remedy over time. You've started that process.
Now if you want to think you were boring, I will share my reasons for my interest in this. The a'capella religious traditions of early America, I've studied sometimes leisurely, sometimes intently, for years.
The progression of harmonics and harmonies(think lilt), though seemingly unchanged, actually did go through substantial change, evolving through shape-note singing, to of course modern inflections and so on.
The earliest renditions and harmonies, were ghostly nearly, and haunting, and very very beautiful, but have been lost in history. I had a chance to encounter this in my studies, and
it even gets more boring.
But, like some historian's study the growth of nationalism and the modern city-state, I, study man's search for meaning throughout history. I do so however, not in a single genre, but in many genres: dance, story telling, rhythm, song, view of the earth and beyond... And so forth.
So, the specific influences as nationalism and so forth in modernity, are a little anecdotal but still important and, for me, interesting.
Jumping to the present, my goal--someday--is to bring interesting voice, to my violin, the instrument most closely linked to human voice.
But in doing so, and part and partial to all the above, besides some good Bach, and E. European, I intend to do some experimental things with ancient ballads I hope, based on my studies.
But my interest in E. E-m, is in the flowing of culture both in modern times, and in early German history as one of several examples. With the tides of change, came mixing and blending of both Mediterranean and Slavic culture. My interest, is in the blending rather than Kepler's experiences getting his mother out of prison for being a herbalist?
We most often for example focus on the classical world (not music) for our academic foundations for instance. But, and here's an image to try and express what I'm talking about: the mother rocking her baby, has little to do with either Aristophanes or Nero. Music, is of the heart--and God.
Now--how's that for boring. Let me go back to my alphabets now.
p.s. Sorry--and back to the subject....
December 15, 2007 at 07:57 PM · Actually, this whole discussion resonates with me. I played violin in my elementary/high school days (the normal classical tradition). However, once I got off to college, I also became an avid folkdancer, particularly Eastern European folk dances, including the Balkans. There was an Eastern European folk ensemble in Los Angeles at that time by the name of Aman, and I met (and obtained) some of their music. There's an absolutely wild Macedonian piece I have that's not too difficult (except for speed), but the key signature has F#/D#, and it's written in 9/8 time! I have usually heard this played with an accordian, dombek (type of drum), and two violins and a bass. I used to jam with Borino Kolo when I came home during the summers, and one night we tackled this piece (and I managed to make it through unscathed!).
I joined a Hungarian immigrant folk ensemble (also in Los Angeles) in the early 1980's. Many of its members were "fresh off the boat", and spoke no English. Many of the Hungarian/Transylvanian dance cycles had been revived by the studies of Kodaly/Bartok. Apparently Bela Halmos started the "tanchaz" movement in the 1970's. If you ever go to Budapest, google "Tanchaz", and you can see where you can go to hear/dance it. The one featuring Bela Halmos' group features dance teaching on the 2nd floor, and a musician jam session and "extensive palinka use" on the fourth floor. (Palinka is a high alcoholic drink made from plums, pears or cherries, and it's potent stuff!).
My group ended up going on tour in Hungary in the summer of 1985. It was definitely quite a different way to see Hungary! I didn't bring my violin with me, but one night in Jasbereny one of the violinists left, and he kindly lent me his instrument, so I could join in the jam (singing and musicians).
You can still get CD's of "Tanchaz" music. By the way, this stuff is GREAT fun to dance to, and takes quite a bit of skill (especially those heel turns, let alone the virtuoso young men's "Legyneschek" (I can't spell this any more!). However, it's all a package - the music (including quite a bit of virtuoso violin work with improvisations), the dancing, the singing, the "tsuyogataschok" during the dancing ...
Es, Mara, en beselek kitchit Magyarul (but don't ask me to spell it any more!). I started by learning the phrase to get a glass of water (hey, rehearsals were strenuous!) - Lehetszives, en kerek edgy pohar vizet. There was no choice - the bartender at the Magyarhaz didn't speak English.
December 15, 2007 at 10:20 PM · No Palinka here, but thanks--took me years to successfully divert from the moonshine. I hear ya though.
And that was fascinating.... Thank you.
When I traveled, for some reason I don't even care to understand really, I always tried to get at that Bartok peasant lady experience, whether it was in gardening, food, customs and etc., not in a peasant sense so much--just ordinary people kind of way.
And living in those countries, gave me a good chance to do that fairly well I think. Just simple things, like watching northern Japanese farmers in the same climate as Siberia, 'invoking' successive farming and getting at least a couple crops out of the ground in a year.
One of my most spectacular memories is that of an elderly Japanese lady in a HUGE rice field all by herself, I suppose planting. I was in to photography then, got down on my belly and the shot! ....
The image was both so peaceful, and just really deep semantically. And though she had a big hat on, she seemed oblivious to the world, and thinking back, me....
And if I start remembering ordinary things about the Azores, I'll be typing all night--maybe another day.
December 16, 2007 at 10:06 PM · Cool fact: Bartok, in writing his Solo Violin Sonata, was influenced in some ways by the American Jazz movement. You can hear it at the end of the second movement, I believe. Blocked chords in fifths...
December 16, 2007 at 11:02 PM · Interesting Joe. EF Korngold, was similarly from a strong European classical tradition, and had a wide straddle over to early American film industry music.
Now--there's a blending of culture come to think of it.... Though it has nothing to do with meaning, or E-EM.....
Definitely interesting though.
January 1, 2008 at 11:48 PM · Oh my god! Geza,I just heard you playing Preludium & Allegro. I never heard anyone else played like that before. It completely took my breath away! Thank you for posting it and happy New Year, Gypsy!:)
Here is the link for those of you haven't heard it:
January 4, 2008 at 12:04 AM · Geza -- YOU ARE AMAZING!!! I hope you can perform more in the United States as you are extremely special. :)
I have not heard such a special young violinist in a long time. I sent you an email, please respond to my email as we need to seriously talk.
January 4, 2008 at 09:50 PM · Wow! I've not come across most of these guys before. Thanks for posting. I really like Sándor Lakatos- amazing left hand!
January 4, 2008 at 10:56 PM · I have at least 3 CDs of Sándor Lakatos. :) It's cheesy, but so good....
January 5, 2008 at 04:41 AM · I posted a lot of YouTube videos of Hungarian violinist Katica Illenyi in my blog here. She plays mostly Jazz and Csardas (nice Bartok Rumanian dances as well) but she isn't a gypsy violinist. I did some searching on YouTube for gypsy violin and I can't say that I much liked what I heard. I guess I prefer the Hungarian interpretation of it.
I know someone mentioned Dinicu earlier but was he really a gypsy violinist? I think he had conservatory training and was probably a lot more like Katica but I don't really know.
January 5, 2008 at 04:48 PM · Song-Duk said:
Geza -- YOU ARE AMAZING!!! I hope you can perform more in the United States as you are extremely special.
And I agree! You may be my favorite among the gypsy violinists -- even though I haven't heard them all yet. You are a unique voice in both gypsy and classical. Bravissimo!
And thanks, Song-Duk for your post which sent me right to Geza's website. Your recommendations, Song-Duk, are pure gold.
January 5, 2008 at 07:45 PM · Roby Lakatos is my favorite. In these times, when there are classical violinists who like bad actors, make the biggest, most extreme, and most superficial show, accompanied by every manner of phony physical contortions, Roby Lakatos is like the great actor who moves the audience deeply with the quality of his performance, rather than attempts to appeal to the superficial. His purity of expression and artistry is such that his playing gains, rather than diminishes with repeated listenings.
January 7, 2008 at 02:45 PM · Thank you to Yixi and Roy for agreeing with me. I am crazy about Geza's playing!!! I posted an official welcome/greeting for Geza in my blog. I don't think many of the v.com members are aware of the significance of his boy's talent. I am offering an online lesson on press-style biography writing for violinists in the earlier career stages. Stay tuned for more details!!!
January 7, 2008 at 09:54 PM · The new press bio for Geza Hosszu-Legocky has been posted on his website at http://www.gezahosszulegocky.com
If you want an example of a poorly written program bio for a young artist along with a "make over" to increase the % of more attention among presenters, I'd suggest checking out my recent blog section for samples. This is free advice from a former artist manager.
January 9, 2008 at 04:54 AM · After listening to all the gypsy violinist you suggested, I'd have to say you are my favorite. Simply amazing and breath-taking. How did you get so good? Are you sure you are human? Check for a pulse and get back to me to let me know... :0) Oh wait, actually, playing the way you do, you most definitely got heart. Okay, so pinch yourself and tell me if you felt it, and that will be the deciding factor.
Amazing vibrato, reminds me of Ivry Gitlis, by the way. I also heard the Kreisler Praeludium and Allegro peformance, and I must say I am going to hate practicing that piece tomorrow, listening to my overwhelming inadequacy, in comparison.
Yeah, and Mr. Song is right. When will you come to America to perform?
January 9, 2008 at 06:29 AM · Geza,
I'd love to hear your opinion on Gilles Apap.
I realize he's not a gypsy violinist, per se, but he explores the gypsy style (at least to my ears) quite a bit. When he does so, how authentic is he, and how would you rank his technique & tone against the best true Gypsy players when they do something similar?
As for the YouTube vids: Of the one's I've seen so far, this one is probably the most humbling:
January 9, 2008 at 09:32 AM · Hallo everybody.
I am happy that my Topic was interesting to you, and that you had possibilities to discuss a little.
I think the Gypsy Violin is a really important Violin Tradition, as Ivry Gitlis, Ida Haendel, and all the greate old fashion Violinist where thinking about it.
I think the Gypsy Violin was shown to much in a bad way, and in a bad time, so i think there are many possibilities to look at the style.
Today we all think Gypsy Violin is about "glissandos" and Monti Csardas. "Most of People who i know".
But actually The old Hungarian gypsy tradition is one of the most greatest things you will ever know.
I mean lets Begin with the real Gypsy Violinists like Jaroka Sandor.
He would be the best example for me, to explain what Hungarian Gypsy Music is.
If you look at all Gypsy Music, the only one which is really different from all, is the Hungarian one.
Romanian, Bulgarian, Balkan, French, German, Gypsy Music have a completely different timing.
I was in all kind of Country's in the World and i felt always so strange talking to a "Non Hungarian Gypsy".
they where so different from our Culture.
And the most important is that Hungarian Gypsy's don't talk Gypsy language.
That's why all the other Gypsy's call us. " Rom Ungro".
It means Strange Man, Different, ore also can be understood as "Goi".
Like the Jewish says "Goi" to the Person who is not a Jew.
to be continued.:-)
In anyways, i have difficulties to write and explain it in English, but if somebody is really interested than i will post the full story in German.))))
It is a really interesting story, maybe ones i will have the chance, i will make a real good Movie, about this Topic.
As i played in a Hollywood Movie, maybe i have sum good chances.:-))
Kiss to all.
January 9, 2008 at 08:37 PM · Geza,
You said gypsy music is not all about glissandos and what people typically think of it. So what techniques would you say does separate gypsy playing from other genres/styles of playing? For example, I notice gypsy violinist vibrato very uniquely in comparison to other violinists.
January 9, 2008 at 10:04 PM · It's the bow technique I think.
January 9, 2008 at 10:31 PM · From what I can tell left-hand technique is also different, a much lighter touch than in classical playing. The use of rubato is somewhat different as well...eh, but why am I trying to explain something I'm ignorant of, I should let Geza do the talking.
August 22, 2008 at 08:50 PM · I was just researching this topic as I'm smitten with this at the moment. Does anyone know anything about Sandor Lakatos as there is absolutely nothing online except that he died in 1994 at the age of 69.
August 23, 2008 at 02:36 AM · Ivry Gitlis
August 23, 2008 at 03:05 AM · there's an interesting discussion between me and mattias as far as gypsy music goes in a recent dvd thread ...
i still stand by what I said, mattias ;-)
but anyway, here are some of my favorites, and i have to admit i'm biased towards hungarian and the roumanian styles.
Joseph Lendvay (the father)
Joseph Lendvay (the son)
Joseph Lendvay (the holy spirit)
a bunch of hungarian violinists (feauting a young roby lakatos)
Sandor Lakatos (most people know him)
Roumanians are great too (this one features a great accordionist Ionica Minune):
the legendary taraf de haidouks:
I also love German/French/Dutch gypsies who mainly play jazz but have a strong hungarian influence
sandro roj (14 yrs old)
titi winterstein (passed away 2 months ago)
the most famous sinti violinist Schnuckenack Reinhardt (not actually a really great player, but he's very old school and is a tremendous influence to the german gypsies)
Dorado schmitt (legendary gypsy guitarist but also plays violin)
January 12, 2010 at 10:41 AM ·
Here is an interesting rendition of a new violinist József Lendvay playing an old favorite –
Enjoy - Ted Kruzich
January 12, 2010 at 04:51 PM ·
As mentioned, my favorite is the "Gypsy Violin And More" video by Martin Lass. Martin is absolutely brilliant!!! One evening when I was in NYC, I attended a musical salon in the famed Oak Room of the Algonquin Hotel. Martin was the featured soloist! He was there with his lovely wife Inge and their daughter. I met them all. He's such a nice guy and very gracious! Inge accompanied him on piano, He played the Hungarian gypsy stuff! He was amazing!!!!! And it was so exciting for me because my own father was Hungarian, so that gypsy stuff is so much a part of me.
January 13, 2010 at 12:14 AM ·
Here are some of my favorites in no particular order:
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Lendvay Csocsi Jozsef (Today's Joseph Lendvay's father)
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Baron Buika :)
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I really enjoy your playing too, Geza! How is your group doing?
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