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Scarampella violins

Instruments: Could I get everyones opinion on Scarampella violins?

From Samuel Mann
Posted November 9, 2005 at 05:11 AM

Could I get everyones opinion on Scarampella violins?

Thank you!

However, they seem to be a pretty solid monetary investment.

Preston

Like Preston said, they're probably the best violin investment of the early 20th Century.

Preston

It's always a treat to see and hear instruments like that. It's funny, a lot of players like Scarampalla, yet collectors and makers think a lot of it is ham fisted work.

"I always thought it should be possible for somebody intelligent to make a violin as good as a Rocca,’ Beare insists. ‘If a Rocca is ten times what you would need to give for a new instrument and the quality and sound are not too far distinguishable then there ought to be a good living in new instruments."

In other words Rocca, Fagnola and Scarampella are overrated. That is not to say that you can't find good semi modern italian violins I tried many but the big names are not worth it.

I’d go along with the description of tone given by a previous poster (masculine, powerful) as a generalization. As far as “investment”, as a good Scarampella can sell for over $125K these days, they seem to have an edge on Fagnola for the present. Yes, like many popular maker’s works, there are many fakes out there.

As far as style, Scarampella was inspired by the works of Maggini and Del Gesu. His work shows that inspiration considerably.
I know many will say that his work is crude, but if one sees Del Gesu examples from his prime & or Maggini, it is the same kind approach that made them so special.

If an instrument (Scarampella)is set up well, it should sound excellent. A friend of mine has a viola by this maker, and it sounds great, and the look is terrific.

You wrote: "As far as style, Scarampella was inspired by the works of Maggini and Del Gesu. His work shows that inspiration considerably."

...and I agree in terms of inpiration. In terms of style, I think of Scarampellas are pretty much Mantuan (often modeled after Balestrieri in particular). If you line up the Mantuan school from Peter Guarneri through Scarampella, you can see a very distinct linear evolution... that's not to say that del Gesu instruments didn't have an effect on this evolution.

As far a "safer" bets, honestly I don't know of a reliable crystal ball. :-) Market history is the only concrete factor one can study (hindsight is 20/20 they say). I can say that I like (certain periods) of many of the makers in your list... and that they can still be had under $100 K (some of the makers for considerably less). BTW; Many of the "Carlo" Bisiachs look like straight forward Sdercis to me... I supect he may have made many of them.

In terms of investment, I was speaking of a better ratio of return in the end. Somehow I've just hear so much great stuff about Fognolas that I wouldn't be surprised that if in the end the return on your investment may be greater than with a Scarempella. (I am, of course, just giving a point of view that is almost completely uneducated in terms of market trends *grin*)

Do you think Scarempellas will remain as popular as they are now or do you think Fagnolas will begin to close the ratio in price?

Preston

Hi Jeffrey,
Yes I agree with what you said, and I know Scarampella used models of Balestrieri but also the models of Del Gesu (according to Duane Rosengard). I mention Maggini and should have included Gasparo da Salò because it seems that Scarampella must have been inspired by the freedom of line similar to that of Del Gesu's work, Maggini's as well as that of Gasparo da Salò.
Being that Maggini & Gasparo da Salò were Brescian as well, would be logical for Scarampella to follow that great tradition.
What some people call crude, others call "free hand", individual, revolutionary and beautiful.
Most beautiful examples of Del Gesu are "free hand", individual, revolutionary and GLORIOUS.
Check out this very interesting website on Scarampella:
this is a cool website

Preston; I agree with Michael about the rise of Fagnola. It's funny, but the instruments I like by that maker (the really good Pressenda copies) aren't the ones that used to get the record prices (the ones that look like red candy apples). As I mentioned, I don't have a crystal ball for market values, but in terms of the past; Scarampella prices have increased at a relatively steady pace while Fagnola made a quick jump a decade ago, then the curve slowed somewhat.

Jim; As I understand it, standard procedure was to re-bar and "correct" thicknesses as needed before marketing. As I wasn't there, I can't say how "automatic" things were. These were not only shops that set up this type of procedure, or the only maker's work that was selected for it, historically.

Gennady; Thanks for the link! How do place a link on this board anyway?

I'd forgotten that review... and hadn't visited the site for a while.

Actually, I do have a photo (Scarampella) on my site that I think supports the model/freedom aspect of what you're saying. It does have a significant bit of del Gesu in the model... but I believe I see that influence appear in Mantua before Scarampella. Maybe it's that he took it to a new level. Since I haven't figured out how to point via a link, you'll need to get there (if you're interested) through the link to my site on my profile. The photo is on the instruments & bows page.

I'll be seeing Duane this weekend. Maybe we'll get into Scarampella at some point. :-)

BTW send Duane my regards.

Oh...who were some of the other well-known makers you allude to when you say historically others had this done on their violins?

How do you think a 7mm thick top sounds? It doesn't. In many cases you don't have to be a genius--you just have to be better than the person before you. :-)

A lot of these guys, their main selling point was their Italian name, and in many cases, that's still the case.

There was a lovely story about this in an early VSA journal, if you can find it somewhere.

Gadda had Scarampella labels and the brand, so in that case an authentic label and brand don't mean much.

What I think of as a good and typical Scarampella

I have a Mario Gadda with "GG" imprinted on the heel of the neck where it meets the body. Inside next to the soundpost, the same inscription is made. The label says Gaetano Gadda with the obvious ode to Scarampella as well... I know that Mario used to fake his dad's stuff all the time.

Mario Gadda is an excellent maker. Those who are familiar with his work, know his work even if it is labeled Scarampella or Gaetano Gadda.

There are plenty of great makers who made honest instruments (17th - 20th cent.) There were also excellent makers who made fantastic copies: J.B. Vuillaume, John Lott, Gaetano Sgarabotto,George Chanot, Voller Brothers to name a few.

My remark about them being "crooks" has absolutely nothing to do with their abilities as violin makers. Rather, it is a comment on their unscrupulous practices.

No,I am currently trying a Scarampella.The certificate issue is related to another instrument.

Today, I don't think making a Scarampella copy would be a very good strategy for winning a violin making competition, if you get my drift.

There must be at least several hundred modern makers whose work exhibits better tone, artistry and workmanship, Darnton and Holmes included.

Investment? That's a bit of a wild card, but if you're patient enough to wait until we die, you might do rather well. :)

I am a big fan of modern makers. North America has a host of terrific modern makers, the three present posters included. I play a modern violin which I have to prove time and time again that it is. It always cracks me up.

That said, there are many current modern violins that sound as good and in many cases better than many Italian instruments in the below 350,000 range. My question: Why then spend so much money on a fiddle? I understand the thought of an instrument as an investment, but unless you were one of the lucky ones to buy in 70's and 80's not knowing what was going to be the case today, I still think that buying a healthy, authentic, terrific sounding modern instrument is a better choice for most young players. Then, you can buy a house too! ;-)

Cheers!

About Christian's violin, yes it is true. That particular maker is very good and antiques his instruments beautifully. I could see people not believing you that the instrument is not very expensive.

Funny thing is, my favourite violin currently is a Gaetano Gadda Guarnerius-style violin of 1948 which is absolutely fantastic in design, workmanship and tone. It has the GG stamp on the button and inside and the usual "Allievo di Stefano Scarampella" label, plus a certificate from the famous Karl Roy of Mittenwald, who I think retouched the varnish. OK, it could just be a Mario Gadda, but on balance I don't think so, especially as it's virtually the spitting image of the 1948 Gadda in the Tarisio archive (but with nicer varnish).

Cheers
Oliver

The Scarampella posted by Jeffrey Holmes looks like it would sound absolutely fabulous.

Clean lines, fine varnish, beautiful wood, strong body. That Scarampella looks a lot better than the other two I've seen, and those two were good violins that didn't really suit my style.

I've seen some really great modern violins, though I haven't yet seen ones by the reknowned makers here David Burgess, Jeffrey Holmes, and Michael Darnton (forgive me if I've missed anybody else). Given that the bar in modern instruments seems to get higher year after year, I wouldn't be surprised if these knowledgeable makers commanded Scarampella like prices even during their lifetimes if not already.

In any case, it's a great violin.

Pieter - Mario Gadda violins are now quite valuable; one sold this month at Skinners in Boston for $11,000 - 1986 I think. My guess is that eventually there won't be much to choose in value betwen a Gaetano and a Mario.

I've seen Gaetanno prices go as high as the 40s, like Mr. Holmes said.

Worth EVERY cent, though...

If you visited the Warrens in the '90s, it was probably James, not Kenneth (Kenneth was Jim's Grandfather who died in the '80s). He's a rather reliable expert, in my experience.

Scott; You are correct in suggesting that opinions are just that; opinions... and rather than try to determine who's "right", I'd say simply that if the violin was purchased from Moenings, it's their responsibility to back up their opinion.

Please note, Peggy wrote:

"When I questioned the 1925 date I was assured that it was a Scarampella, but it was finished in his shop after he died."

Many of the later Scarampellas were made by Gadda... who it seems did to continue to come up with posthumous Scarampella instruments for a good number of years (...wonder where he was finding them? :-)). Could conceivably be that both opinions are correct, I suppose.

Personally, when encountering these late instruments, unless the hand is rather obvious (which it often isn't), I'd tend err on the conservative side... but that's me.

Peggy- do you still use your Scarampella? How much did Ken Warren "apprais it" for in the 90s? Thanks for your input!

The violin I posted a photo of is dated 1904.

Not that I want to get into evaluations "blind", but yes, Gadda would have managed to capture the style and features of his teacher/employers instruments... He knew them well.

But I saw one at Moennigs for $75K becuase they seemed to think Gadda had some impact on it.

I'm with Jeffrey on this one...you have to be very careful. It is possible that someone else might think that it was all Gadda and not just some. My guess (and I do mean guess)is a Gadda goes for something like $15k to $25k.

Kevin

I own a Stefano Scarampella, which I've owned for nearly four years, and I absolutely love it.  It has rich tone, and I don't find it at all difficult to handle.  Obviously it's not the best out there, but I love the violin I own.  The thing about violins is that everyone prefers something different in feel and sound.  I love my violin, whereas others might not like it at all.  But of course, I would definitely recommend trying them, at least...  = )

 I have a friend who owns a Scarampella viola, and it is excellent and the owner loves it.

i have not read all the previous responses, but fakes abound for this particular maker.

The fakes by Scarampella's pupil Gaetano Gadda of Mantua are valuable in themselves ($20,000 or more). They usually have very nice workmanship, wood and varnish; beautifully clean-cut and sinuous f-holes, with the lower lobe scalloped (hollowed out) and often having a slightly outward point like Guarneri (which makes the lower end-holes slope noticeably inwards); and typically a scroll whose turn finishes at dead bottom rather than continuing round for a further 45 degrees or so. They usually seem to be slightly narrower in the upper waist than a real Scarampella, and with more "pointy" corners. I have owned two of them myself, and once you get to know them, they are very distinguishable from the personal work of Scarampella.

There are also the more modern fake Scarampellas from the workshop of Mario Gadda of Mantua (died 2005, son of Gaetano). They are usualler cruder in appearance than the older Gaetano Gadda "Scarampellas". One of the major auctioneers recently sold a violin which was certified by Mario Gadda as a Scarampella, and they catalogued it as "probably by Gaetano Gadda", but my suspicions are that it was probably a product of the Mario Gadda shop, complete with artificial aging.

One of the better Italian makers of the early to mid 20th century, Enrico Politi of Rome, is also believed to have been a faker of Scarampellas, though I think on a much smaller scale. A Scarampella fake by Politi was auctioned a year or two ago, and it looked rather more like a real Scarampella than the Gaetano Gadda instruments which do in fact seem to have a personality of their own despite being "fakes".

I suspect that other Mantuan makers such as Amadeo Simonazzi and Oreste Martini may also have occasionally joined in the fun, and I have also wondered about the Guastalla brothers of Reggiolo, at least one of whom was also a pupil of Scarampella. 

Who was responsible for all this? Well, the heaviest resposibility I think lies with the prominent US violin dealers who promoted Scarampella violins, created a market for them, and then after Scarampella' death went on buying them year after year from makers like Gadda who were only too willing to supply them. If the dealers had been the slightest bit critical in their thought processes, they would have known that the almost endless supply of Scarampella violins dated mostly in the period about 1905 to 1914 was too good to be true. I suspect they knew but kept their mouths shut.

In addition to all this, there are of course many cheap violins (Chinese included) which in more modern times have been re-labelled as Scarampellas and, like many other cheap violins labelled as Italian, can be bought on Ebay and elsewhere.

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