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Difference between a 14inch viola and a full size violin

Instruments: Difference between a 14inch viola and a full size violin

From P. Trouvé
Posted November 2, 2009 at 06:41 PM

Hi,

I'm a VERY small person, less than 5 feet with very short arms and fingers.  I have to play viola for my quartet.  For now, I put viola strings on my old violin.  My teacher suggested that I buy a 14inch viola, but when I went on e-bay I realized that there was no difference between a 14inch viola and my violin!!! Should there be some? Which one.

Many thanks!

They're different internally as well as the obvious differences in fitting the nut and bridge to the strings.  I believe that the size and placement of the bass bar, in particular, is different.

Well, the main visible difference is that the 14" viola has taller ribs (thus greater internal volume) than an equivalent violin.

Violas may be wider than violins also. I find 14 inches too small in order to get a good C string, I think that perhaps you could manage to play a 15 or 15 1/2 viola.

I would like to add also that playing confort is not only related to the size, but also to weight, rib heigh and string length, all these variables can have a huge impact in relation to playing confort.

www.manfio.co

 I've certainly heard some violins that passed as excellent small violas and some large violas that were set up as fractional cellos!

If your violin sounds good and you are satisfied with it then that's all anyone needs to know.

Violinmakers have thousands of rules they follow but the only rule that you should apply is: does it work well, does it sound good?

Oded Kishony

Hi,

I'm sorry, I also thought that viola were bigger but I'm a bit confused.

What about  this viola?:

Viola Size: 14   Back length :356mm   Upper Bout:170mm Middle Bout:110mm

Lower Bout:210mm  Overall Length :587 mm  Rib Height :35 mm 

Where is the differences with my violin? It seems pretty much the same as my 2 "cheap violins

"Many thanks again!

I hope this does not sound rude, but the difference between a 14" violin and a 14" viola is only how they are strung. It will be very frustrating trying to obtain any real tonal weight that a violist will need in ensemble playing.

If your stature is the problem, you might find something usable in ergonomic violas. You can see one example (viola #116) on my web site http://singingwoodsviolin.com or on the web sites of other makers like David Rivinus (you might have to Google him). If other makers on the board know of other models, speak up! This individual needs our assistance.

My favorite response to this problem (You're not the only one by far to have had it) is to suggest that you can play a much bigger viola if you are willing to hold it vertically on an end pin such as the New Family alto violin. It seems counter-intuitive, but played this way a smaller player actually has an advantage in holding the instrument.

A few years ago I purchased a 5-string violin. This is essentially  a 5-string VIOLA with an E string. Helicore sells a C string that will perfectly fit a 14-inch instrument. It is not a bad viola and it is not a bad violin (especially not for $300). I've heard both violas and violins that sounded worse, not that I would want to play them.

You do want to be sure that you are not "saddled" with a heavy-weight too-large viola bridge. A decent violin bridge will work just fine. I had to remove the viola bridge that came on my 5-string and refit it with a 5-notched violin bridge. I also had to remove the overweight, tailpiece with built-in fine tuners and replace it with a lighter 5-string tailpiece. These improvements greatly helped the tone and playability.

The hardest thing about a 5-string violin is bowing the right string when I'm reading music; second hardest is getting my big fingers in the right place on the strings. Maybe it's time to convert it to a 14-inch viola, hadn't thought about that before. Thanks!

Andy

"If your violin sounds good and you are satisfied with it then that's all anyone needs to know.

Violinmakers have thousands of rules they follow but the only rule that you should apply is: does it work well, does it sound good?"

___________________

Oded summed it up quite well. Don't worry too much about what a viola is "supposed" to be. If your violin with viola strings works well for you for now, that's what matters.

Thnaks to all!

In fact my old violin with viola string sounds better as a viola than a violin. I am preparing exams for Toronto conservatory of music in violin, and was wondering if I should change for viola.  If so, could I do exam on that violin changed into a viola.  also could I play as a viola player in amateur orchestra with such a small viola.  I am small, my arm length is not 24inches, more like 23.5 inches.  so for monetary reason (prefer spending on lessons for now) and for making my life a bit easier, I liked the idea of the 14inch viola.  But is my violin converted into a viola, accpetable? for exams and orchestra?

Many thanks again!

Ask the teacher or the conservatory for 100% confirmation, they should be nice enough to let you know instead of failing you on the spot  ; )

And I believe you go to: RCM [Royal conservatory of music] ?

The 14 inch viola should have considerably thinner construction of its plates and ribs than a violin in order to sound reasonable on the C string.  It helps a little to make the f holes smaller in area (narrower) too and the ribs higher as was mentioned earlier.

A big problem with small violas is their C strings lack high enough tension.  One reason small violins are not very loud because of this lack of string tension rather than their small size.  I recommend using heavy C strings.

The first is played by an inadequate prick, and the second ...

... OK, I give in, what's the answer?

My two cents:

1. If you don't want to spend $$$ on another instrument, that's reasonable. However, in the future when you can afford to buy a real viola, don't let your size limit you. I'm 5'2" with unusually short arms and small hands, but I managed a year of graduate studies on a 16.5 viola. After that year I decided my life could be easier and switch down to 16. I can play octaves without stretching and have a good vibrato in 1st position. Recently I learned to play fingered unisions as it was called for in a piece.

My point is, nobody knows how big of an instrument you can handle. On the viola you have to be more fluid in your thinking about techniques. On the violin, maybe your teacher would say "this is how your LH should be positioned" and you copy that and it's fine. On the viola, your teacher and your teacher's viola will pretty much always be different from your size and your viola and your arm. So you have to figure out why things work a certain way and not others, and then you have you figure out a system that works for you.

2. A small, 14 inch viola is most definitely different from a normal violin. There are  plenty other posts explaining to you why already. Right now, you might be satisfied with the novelty of a newfound "deep" sound on your restrung violin, but soon you will be wanting more varieties in your sound.

3. If you are playing in a quartet as a violist, you will soon realize that you'll have to be able to pull out like 5 different versions of Eb at any given moment, depending on whether you are tuning to the cellist or the violinists (I know that you are supposed to tune to the lower strings, but I garauntee that you will encounter at least one violinist who wants you to match him/her)

This sounds weird but I promise it's not-- it's actually easier to find different gradations of Eb or any other note when your instrument is bigger...

I sell and rent a decent amount of 14" Violas as well as 4/4 violins.  The typical difference is in the thickness.  With 2 to 4mm difference I believe that the sound difference will be slight.  If you can get to a 15" (possibly with a slightly thinner neck to help with your reach)  I think you'll start to notice a bg difference in sound.  If you do go with a 14" Viola or 4/4 Violin strung as a viola make sure to get SM (short) viola strings designed for Violas 15" or less.  Good luck.

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